Wednesday, February 4, 2009

Genghis on the New and Improved Chopper 5

Last night I had a conversation with Genghis6199. Genghis, supposedly a no-planer, is a very well-known 9/11 researcher and videomaker. Here is his forum. Have a listen to our talk, and see if you don't think Genghis is trying to bully me into surrendering my theory for no good reason, while trying to rehabilitate the airplane hoax. 

Ace Baker / Genghis conversation, part 1
Ace Baker / Genghis conversation, part 2
Ace Baker / Genghis conversation, part 3

I wanted to talk to Genghis about the NEW AND IMPROVED version of Chopper 5, the one with the plane in the wide shot. One previously available version (Hoffman/Salter) had no plane in the wide shot at all, while another previously available version (Avery/Lawson) had a plane visible in 3 frames during the zoom in only. The new version (Dr. Ebbets) is an interlaced version of the same VHS source as Avery/Lawson. 

In an email to me, Genghis said of the new and improved Dr. Ebbets version:
 "it's a legitimate find. it's authenticity is not in doubt."
This seems quite an odd comment for anyone, much less a supposed no-planer. This new version has appeared out of the blue, we have no idea who actually has the VHS tape from which it was made, or who digitized it. Why would Genghis not at least SUSPECT that an airplane was added to the wide shot? I think that's just what they did. I wouldn't be A BIT SURPRISED if they come out with a "new and improved" version of CNN Ghostplane. One that shows the columns breaking!

We do know that the new Dr. Ebbets version is cropped differently than the previous Avery/Lawson version. Why? It's suspicious, because the far right-hand edge (where the plane comes in) is cropped away now. 

The chroma (color) of the Dr. Ebbets version is accurate, like its frame-blended predecessor Avery/Lawson. The Hoffman/Salter version has been brightened. So the new Dr. Ebbets ought to have finer detail than Hoffman/Salter, but strangely the detail is less fine. This strongly suggests that the quality of Dr. Ebbets was reduced, then enlarged back up to  720 x 480 dimensions. Why?

In fact, I not only SUSPECT someone added an airplane to Dr. Ebbets, I can prove it. The proof comes in attempting to recreate the lesser-quality versions from the higher-quality versions. I've already shown that brightening the old Avery/Lawson does NOT disappear the airplane, therefore brightening did not erase any airplane in the wide shot from Hoffman/Salter.

Genghis and I get into this in our conversation. And we learn several other very interesting things about Genghis. 
  • Genghis says Chopper 5 is fake, but doesn't really have a reason why.
  • Genghis thinks perhaps a missile was used, but doesn't explain how they made it look like a 767. 
  • Genghis says the image in CNN Ghostplane is not the image of a 767, that it keeps changing shape, and doesn't match up correctly with a known image of a 767.
  • Genghis thinks the fake plane might be a hologram. 
  • Genghis thinks it is physically possible to see a hologram projected into thin air. 

The laws of physics dictate that thin-air holograms are strictly impossible, because any projected image needs something to reflect off of in order to go into your eye (or the camera). If Genghis can suspend the laws of physics to allow for thin-air holograms, why not just pretend that planes can meld into steel and concrete buildings? And that those buildings can then crush themselves into fine powder under their own weight?



Anonymous said...

If I get into a car accident, the insurance company will not pay a single penny until someone from the insurance company (an appraiser) or someone from the shop (under oath) verifies the VIN number from the vehicle...the vehicle identification number. Regardless of whether 100 Billion people witnessed the car crashing, they pay nothing until the VIN is verified. Regardless of whether 100 Billion photos and 100 Billion videos were taken of the car auto insurance company will not pay one single penny until it physically verifies the VIN number on the vehicle itself. And that's for a $5,000 car. Now fast forward to the multi-million dollar planes of 911.......

The airline insurance companies will pay nothing until they verify the Serial ID numbers on the planes themselves....just like a car. A standard 757 has over 3 million verifiable ID parts. On 911...that’s almost 12 million parts that could be verified to pay a claim. Though get this...not one single penny has been paid by airline insurance companies for any of the 4 planes lost on 911. Why? Despite Billions of witnesses, billions of photos, and billions of videos and TV viewers.....the airline insurance companies only pay by verifiable wreckage. Just like a car. TO THIS DAY....NOT ONE SINGLE PIECE OF AIRLINER DEBRIS FROM ANY OF THE 4 PLANES FROM ANY OF THE 4 LOCATIONS ON 911 HAS EVER BEEN VERIFIED IN ANY WAY. Not one single piece.

Once you come to terms with the fact that there were no commercial planes on will begin to understand the true crimes of the US political regimes.

Every time I read about you guys arguing or discussing "how" the planes were reminds me of the arguments about "how" they disappeared the "passengers". Who knows? These people are pysocipathic murderers. Who cares about knowing how or why they did what they did. Just know the planes were fake and move on. What does no commercial planes mean? You will never move forward by arguing "how" these killers did what they did. They got over it 7 years ago. No planes means no planes regardless of how. Focusing on the unknown details is exactly what these criminals want you to do. It’s a never ending circle of doubt, facts, and missing pieces that not even the murderers know. Remember…these are vicious, psychotic, soul-less, vindictive murderers. They care about “how” they faked these deaths about as much as picking up dog shit. We know there were no planes…but where do we go from here?!!! What does it all mean?

Anonymous said...

I hate to get into this business of calling people "shills" and so forth, and I hate the politics of the 9/11 movement generally, but something about Genghis strikes me as fishy.

Let's think about it this way. We know that the perpetrators of 9/11 want to "controlled the opposition". Okay, so you have the actual movement that the elites support, along with the controlled opposition (which either subtly supports the same goals in some way, or at least funnels the dissent into ineffectual and counterproductive channels). Fine. But what happens when some people figure out what's going on and start opposing the controlled opposition? Well then the elites need to... control the opposition to the controlled opposition. And when people start opposing that? Then control the opposition to the controlled opposition to the controlled opposition... and so on it goes, for as many recursions as it takes.

I first learned of Genghis and his little forum when posting on the 9/11 movement forum, when there was a big stink up about this jerk Genghis who was criticizing Killtown and all this stuff. Being the curious sort, I naturally went over and checked out what the guy had to say. At first my impression was generally favorable, since I'd been noticing a lot of problems with the ideas the guys at Movement had and the way they censored any critics. But later something occurred to me: were Killtown and the others at the 9/11 Movement board constantly mentioning Genghis because they were genuinely angry at him, or were they *advertising* him as the primary opposition to the "3D desktop warfare" crowd (i.e. positioning Genghis as the next layer of controlled opposition), in order to take attention away from potential genuine opposition?

I don't know if Genghis is controlled opposition or not, but he is suspicious. On the one hand, I think 9/11 Taboo is an impressive piece of work, and he does a good job debunking Simon Shack. At the same time, he's got a lot of strange and seemingly mutually contradictory views on 9/11, and when questioned about this he usually gives some sort of non-response. He's also accused virtually everyone on the planet of being Killtown, effectively ending any productive inquiry into that (admittedly not terribly important) question. His forum is definitely filled with all sorts of idiots and crackpots - I guess he can't really be blamed for who registers and posts on his site, but he doesn't seem to tolerate much criticism of them, especially if they happen to be female. So his forum definitely does not serve as a useful base for furthering the understanding of the events of 9/11.

Well, who knows... hard to sort out the shills from the people who are genuinely confused. The important thing is to keep pressing along with logic and evidence, and let the problematic people sort themselves out.

engineer said...

No planes, period.

The "Plants" have been hugely successful in maintaining an aura of confusion. Doubt comes easy on the topic anyway. Some are paid (like junk science on the climate change issue), some are just mean, like the virus planters. Some are just jingoistic flag wavers.

People come out with claims while ignoring the companion impossible.

A chain is not complete without all the links.

But the sheep are pressing hardest on the difficult questions now that they are close to no planes.

"but what happened to the planes? They did leave the gate."

as mentioned above.

"how could everyone at NORAD/Boeing remain quiet on the matter?"

"how could they plant the nukes, thermite, you name it?"

On and on.

L.L. said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

LL......How can you convict a serial killer without finding the bodies? Thousands of people are in prison for life without ever finding a single "body" or explaining exactly what happened to the victims. We could spend the rest of our lives discussing why and how these politcal criminals lied the most. What do we get out of it? The lies will long outlive the truth because the exacting truth is irrelevant. WE know the truth...though figuring out the EXACT truth will never happen. Not even the perpetrators know the exact truth.

Ace....we know 911 was a fabricated, staged, slaughter, colluded, conspired lie....but now what? What do we do now? Convince more people that 911 was a lie? Then what? What happens AFTER we all know it was a lie. Then what?

L.L. said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
engineer said...

"Then what? What happens AFTER we all know it was a lie. Then what?"

1. This revokes the license for the "War on Terror", if the connection has not by then completely faded.

2. It destroys the very popular myth that governments are something to hold in awe, worship, trust. Just the opposite. So people can be on guard, hopefully.

Hanging people is not important. That is revenge. Changes nothing for the better back. Besides, they can pass the blame around for years.

spooked said...

reading the comments made by Genghis at the Pumpitout forum on this topic, you'd be hard pressed to know that he even is a "no planer". His attitude is extremely strange there, and I'm not at all surprised by what he said in your conversation.

Anonymous said...

Do you actually think the military, the military owned media, and the military owned and controlled government are going to end a perpetual and never ending war?!!! It has provided Trillions of dollars with no signs of letting up now that it is "global". I am starting to rethink what the "cold war" was. The same people involved with that 50 year war are in power today. What did the US get out of that endless war identical to the war on evil or the war on terror? Other ideas of what no planes means:

Here are just a few samples of what NO PLANES on 9-11 means:
• It would mean Larry Silverstein committed the largest insurance fraud in world history
• It would mean Bush lied about watching the first plane go into WTC 1
• It would mean hundreds of staged “terrorist drill participants” on the morning of 911 also lied. They were involved with a program called Able Danger in NYC on the very morning of 911.
• It would mean all government and military authorities at the Pentagon lied about identifying the remains of the passengers through DNA testing
• It would mean the “news” media and the hundreds of witnesses that were directly connected to the media companies themselves all lied about what they saw. (Watch “September Clues” to get a sample at the vast number of “media witnesses” that were the only ones interviewed on 911
• It would mean that Rupert Murdoch and his video feed to the world on every channel was a staged, conspired, and complicit lie to kill 1000’s of people
• It would call into question all leading media personnel who have refused to even allow ANY discussion of this topic such as Amy Goodman of NPR, Bill Maher, Arianna Huffington, Noam Chomsky, Tom Hartman…..add more of your own names. These people covered it up and allowed no dissention or discussion. They must be considered perpetrators.
• It would mean the Bush hand selected committee of 911 Commission is and would have been a complete farce (many already know this just based on results)
• It would expose the “remote controlled plane theory” as a rabbit hole. What this theory does is even if you are unsure that remotes may have been used…you are forced into accepting that there are planes to control in the first place.
• THERE WERE NO HIGHJACKERS. That means everyone in government, law enforcement, military, FBI, CIA, White House, media ALL lied and conspired to pass blame to people who never existed. This explains why 8 of the 19 are still alive and why none of them were on any passenger list or have ever been identified with DNA
• It would mean workers in Shanksville, at ground zero, and the Pentagon all planted evidence at a crime scene
• ALL of the “amateur footage” that was taken on the morning of 911 was doctored and fraudulent. The people that have reported and given as evidence their false video must be prosecuted. ALL of the amateur video was turned into authorities days after 911 giving plenty of time for the forgeries (some not very good and horribly inconsistent with each other)
• It means that millions of civilians and untold thousands of soldiers have been killed and slaughtered based on a known and conspired crime. War on Terror was a lie. ALL of it.
• Just the mere mention that there were no planes on 911 will have you banned from “truth groups” and deleted from even the most liberal of website forums. There are Trillions of dollars at stake should the public realize that no planes existed on 911.
• ALL the witnesses from USA Today at the Pentagon lied about the planes. They must be tried for treason.
• If this was a “New Pearl Harbor” we must go back a review everything regarding the fact that Pearl Harbor itself was a staged and conspired and fraudulent event. Is there any evidence to support the government claims of Pearl Harbor? Any Japanese planes shot down? Any testing of the ships for man-made explosives allowed?
• It also forces you to go back and see if this was planned since Bush took office and also the evidence that Bush fixed the elections in 2000 and 2004 to bring about this crime. His Presidency in the future could easily become “null and void”. His could be the first Presidency that the US could say never really happened because of all the known lies, cheating, fraud, conspiracy, crimes, and election rigging.
• “Authorities” and criminals within government have always said there was NO controlled demolition because it was the “planes” that brought the towers down. No planes means that of course the WTC’s 1, 2, and 7 were brought down with controlled demolitions and it implicates dozens of government agencies like NIST, FEMA, NTSB that all lied about the results, tests, and testimonies.
• No planes also forces you to look VERY CLOSELY at the passenger lists of the 4 planes reported missing on 911. Did any of them have close ties to banking, military, law or law enforcement, media, government, devout Christianity, or insurance…….basically the groups that profited the most from 911? (97% of all the passengers on all 4 planes have direct ties to these groups of perpetrators! Look for yourself)